BorlandTalk.com Borland discussion newsgroups   Archives   FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  Comparing voice files with Delphi? Goto page 1, 2  Next          BorlandTalk.com Forum Index -> Delphi Non-Technical View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message Michael Fullerton Guest Posted: Mon May 17, 2004 9:13 pm    Post subject: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Does anyone have any suggestions on how I could use Delphi to compare two different files (in my case simple speech files) that would indicate how similar they are to each other? Are there any Bayesian filter type libraries available? Thanks in advance ___ Free Project Time Tracker for Delphi Developers http://www.cyber-matrix.com/pcdelphi.html Back to top Boian Mitov Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 2:15 am    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Well, I don't have a Bayesian filter, but I can offer you filters FFT etc., as a basis for potential further processing. Please visit www.mitov.com for more details. You can use the products for free for non commercial purposes. I hope they will help. If you need the AudioLab, I can send you a prerelease install. With best regards, Boian Mitov Michael Fullerton wrote: Quote: Does anyone have any suggestions on how I could use Delphi to compare two different files (in my case simple speech files) that would indicate how similar they are to each other? Are there any Bayesian filter type libraries available? Thanks in advance ___ Free Project Time Tracker for Delphi Developers http://www.cyber-matrix.com/pcdelphi.html Back to top Rene Tschaggelar Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 9:21 am    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Michael Fullerton wrote: Quote: Does anyone have any suggestions on how I could use Delphi to compare two different files (in my case simple speech files) that would indicate how similar they are to each other? Are there any Bayesian filter type libraries available? You're aware what kind of task you're at ? Usually data is compared for similarity with crosscorrelation. Speech is a bit more complex in the aspect that it cannot be considered to be "one piece" but of sequences. Therefore you cannot fouriertransform a sentence and compare it with another. You rather have to compare wavelets. Without prior knowledge, don't expect results within a few months. It becomes even harder with background noise or when something should be understood. Rene Back to top Michael Fullerton Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 3:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? "Rene Tschaggelar" <ee123123wqe12 (AT) sd242323 (DOT) com> wrote: Quote: Michael Fullerton wrote: Does anyone have any suggestions on how I could use Delphi to compare two different files (in my case simple speech files) that would indicate how similar they are to each other? Are there any Bayesian filter type libraries available? You're aware what kind of task you're at ? Usually data is compared for similarity with crosscorrelation. Speech is a bit more complex in the aspect that it cannot be considered to be "one piece" but of sequences. Therefore you cannot fouriertransform a sentence and compare it with another. You rather have to compare wavelets. At this point what would be compared are simple human speech sounds (ah, ooh, ee) not even words. Quote: Without prior knowledge, don't expect results within a few months. It becomes even harder with background noise or when something should be understood. Background noise is not an issue and I just need a comparison of how similar the person's sound is with the saved sound. ___ Free Project Time Tracker for Delphi Developers http://www.cyber-matrix.com/pcdelphi.html Back to top Boian Mitov Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 4:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? The package I have also has a wavelet, but you may as well check on Torry www.torry.net . There was a set of components ( at least one ), for neuron networks. It looks like a good candidate. You can record multiple time a voice from a single person, and then use SignalLab www.mitov.com to get the FFT over time. Feed the output to a neuron network, and teach it to recognize the phrases. With best regards, Boian Mitov Michael Fullerton wrote: Quote: "Rene Tschaggelar" <ee123123wqe12 (AT) sd242323 (DOT) com> wrote: Background noise is not an issue and I just need a comparison of how similar the person's sound is with the saved sound. ___ Free Project Time Tracker for Delphi Developers http://www.cyber-matrix.com/pcdelphi.html Back to top Rene Tschaggelar Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 4:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Michael Fullerton wrote: Quote: "Rene Tschaggelar" <ee123123wqe12 (AT) sd242323 (DOT) com> wrote: Michael Fullerton wrote: Does anyone have any suggestions on how I could use Delphi to compare two different files (in my case simple speech files) that would indicate how similar they are to each other? Are there any Bayesian filter type libraries available? You're aware what kind of task you're at ? Usually data is compared for similarity with crosscorrelation. Speech is a bit more complex in the aspect that it cannot be considered to be "one piece" but of sequences. Therefore you cannot fouriertransform a sentence and compare it with another. You rather have to compare wavelets. At this point what would be compared are simple human speech sounds (ah, ooh, ee) not even words. Without prior knowledge, don't expect results within a few months. It becomes even harder with background noise or when something should be understood. Background noise is not an issue and I just need a comparison of how similar the person's sound is with the saved sound. Still... Try to say a sentence multiple times the same way, perhaps with a day in between. What is done is compare a word with a set of recordings of this word. Then with some expertise you may find the word to be examined to be within the set. Rene Back to top Boian Mitov Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 5:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? I think a neuron network can help. Rene Tschaggelar wrote: Quote: Michael Fullerton wrote: Still... Try to say a sentence multiple times the same way, perhaps with a day in between. What is done is compare a word with a set of recordings of this word. Then with some expertise you may find the word to be examined to be within the set. Rene Back to top Rene Tschaggelar Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 8:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? A neuron network is the last straw when all ideas are exhausted. By throwing a vast cpu power in a rather uncorrelated way at the problem you'll be stuck for month trying all sort of configurations with all sort of parameters while still not learning. Neuron networks tend to keep their secrets for themselves. So unless you have a job at a research institute and don't like summer wheather, stay away from these neuron networks. Rene Boian Mitov wrote: Quote: I think a neuron network can help. Rene Tschaggelar wrote: Michael Fullerton wrote: Still... Try to say a sentence multiple times the same way, perhaps with a day in between. What is done is compare a word with a set of recordings of this word. Then with some expertise you may find the word to be examined to be within the set. Back to top Jan Mitrovics Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 9:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Boian Mitov wrote: Quote: I think a neuron network can help. Neural networks are a sience of their own. You will need a lot of experience, before you can make effiecient use of them. If you want to give it a try, there is a component set of neural networks available at (Help file in Russian...): http://www.basegroup.ru/download/neuralbase.en.htm There are also some shareware libraries available at Torry, etc. If you want to first get a feeling and some background on neural nets, this might be interesting for you: http://www-ra.informatik.uni-tuebingen.de/software/JavaNNS/welcome_e.htm l If the interest is on classification and statistics on a broader range, the SDL component suite for Delphi might be interesting: http://www.lohninger.com I would initially not start with a neural network, but with PCA / LDA projections and a Mahalonobis distance or something similar. Jan Back to top Boian Mitov Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 9:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Hi Rene, It was just an idea . I don't use them, but I think they have a good potential for the particular task. In any case what he is trying to achieve is not straight forward, and the neuron networks have their advantages in this area. Indeed this is what they have been designed for. One of them on the Torry's page has a OCR demo that resembles some of the stuff needed in this case. With my signal processing components and the modified OCR code, he may be able to get what he is trying to achieve, however it will not be easy. With best regards, Boian Rene Tschaggelar wrote: Quote: A neuron network is the last straw when all ideas are exhausted. By throwing a vast cpu power in a rather uncorrelated way at the problem you'll be stuck for month trying all sort of configurations with all sort of parameters while still not learning. Neuron networks tend to keep their secrets for themselves. So unless you have a job at a research institute and don't like summer wheather, stay away from these neuron networks. Rene Back to top Jan Mitrovics Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 10:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Rene Tschaggelar wrote: Quote: A neuron network is the last straw when all ideas are exhausted. Using them this way is asking for trouble. Quote: By throwing a vast cpu power in a rather uncorrelated way at the problem you'll be stuck for month trying all sort of configurations with all sort of parameters while still not learning. More problematic in my experience is that they may also fool you by overfitting if you are not aware of how to use them correctly. They may be powerfull in the hands of very experienced people, but they lead the unexperienced directly into chaos. Quote: Neuron networks tend to keep their secrets for themselves. There are ways to get information from the network itself, but it's not straight forward and needs careful planning. Another problem is how to integrate preexisting knowledge into them (unlike Bayesian classifiers). Quote: So unless you have a job at a research institute and don't like summer wheather, stay away from these neuron networks. LOL. Yep, that's the way it is! Jan Back to top Boian Mitov Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 10:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Well, you have convinced me guys . I will stay away from them. Well, then again, I like to play games, so I may, just may be will touch them sometime in the future, but surely not now . Take care, Boian Jan Mitrovics wrote: Quote: So unless you have a job at a research institute and don't like summer wheather, stay away from these neuron networks. LOL. Yep, that's the way it is! Jan Back to top Jan Mitrovics Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 10:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Boian Mitov wrote: Quote: Well, you have convinced me guys . I will stay away from them. Well, then again, I like to play games, so I may, just may be will touch them sometime in the future, but surely not now . Take care, Boian Boian, Your Open Wire stuff is propably quite appropriate for neural networks. It might actually be fun to play with them (if you have some spare time and no project schedule that can be screwed up...) Jan Back to top Boian Mitov Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 10:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? Hi Jan, Thanks! That's what I had in mind . I am working on 2 projects 1 Delphi and 1 C++ ( A pure C++ OpenWire version for a particular customer. It is designed to compile on embedded devices as well, and may be sent to the outer space if the project succeeds ), plus I am working on the last component of AudioLab prior prerelease version. There is some VideoLab work under way as well, so the neuron networks will have to wait a bit . ( Did I mention that the OpenWire editor work may be resurrected later this year ? ) With best regards, Boian Jan Mitrovics wrote: Quote: Boian, Your Open Wire stuff is propably quite appropriate for neural networks. It might actually be fun to play with them (if you have some spare time and no project schedule that can be screwed up...) Jan Back to top Boian Mitov Guest Posted: Tue May 18, 2004 10:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Comparing voice files with Delphi? BTW: I am doing some research work in the direction of computer vision, and the neuron networks may come in handy Boian Jan Mitrovics wrote: Quote: Boian, Your Open Wire stuff is propably quite appropriate for neural networks. It might actually be fun to play with them (if you have some spare time and no project schedule that can be screwed up...) 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