BorlandTalk.com Borland discussion newsgroups   Archives   FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  Developing in a VM Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next          BorlandTalk.com Forum Index -> Delphi Non-Technical View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message Bern Rudisill Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 3:03 pm    Post subject: Developing in a VM Hello everyone, I am converting over my development to start developing in VMs, I can see a great benefit of being able to backup the exact development system (VCLs and all) when creating my masters at each release. Are there any suggestions from anyone already doing this? Also how do you handle your source code? Do you have in the actual VM or do you have it on your physical Hard Drive and access it through the VM? Thanks Bern -- Back to top David Perkins Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 4:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Quote: It's a great way to work. You need enough RAM to make it go (processor speed is less important). I have 1G and I can only really have one VM open at a time (I'm using VMWare). Is there much difference in the speed of compilation? Back to top Ingvar Nilsen Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 4:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Jim Cooper wrote: Quote: Are there any suggestions from anyone already doing this? It's a great way to work. You need enough RAM to make it go (processor speed is less important). I have 1G and I can only really have one VM open at a time (I'm using VMWare). While I have used VMWare a lot, and use it a lot, especially when testing stuff, I dropped it for development because it does not understand my multi monitor setup. Quote: I use one VM only for testing software I've downloaded, so my host machine is much cleaner than it used to be I have had problems installing software on VMs. Those using DirectX, games etc. seem to dislike the VM. -- Ingvar Nilsen http://www.ingvarius.com Back to top Jesper Hogstrom (Borland) Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 4:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Bern Rudisill wrote: Quote: Are there any suggestions from anyone already doing this? Also how do you handle your source code? Do you have in the actual VM or do you have it on your physical Hard Drive and access it through the VM? My experience from trying this seemed to indicate disk access is faster when accessing the virtual disk than when accessing a shared folder on the host machine. ymmv. If you want to be able to make a complete snapshot/clone you are better off having everything in your environment on the VM. That does not in any way speak against using a source control system. --Jesper Back to top Ralf Mimoun Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 4:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Bern Rudisill wrote: Quote: Hello everyone, I am converting over my development to start developing in VMs, I can see a great benefit of being able to backup the exact development system (VCLs and all) when creating my masters at each release. Same here - and I can switch to another computer in almost no time. Foobar'ed hardware does not puzzle me, I am back in business in about 10 minutes. Quote: Are there any suggestions from anyone already doing this? Get RAM. More RAM. I work with 2 GB, less and you have to think too often what you must close (eg. a small VM running the db server) to open another VM. Quote: Also how do you handle your source code? Do you have in the actual VM or do you have it on your physical Hard Drive and access it through the VM? In the VM, but as a copy of a svn repository. That svn server is running on another machine, of course also in a VM :-) Ralf Back to top Jim Cooper Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 4:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Quote: Is there much difference in the speed of compilation? Not noticeable in Delphi 6,7,2006 or VS 2003,2005 If you sat down and actually measured it there might be, but it's not significant I'm assuming all files to be local to the VM, BTW. Network access can be slow sometimes, although internet access seems fine Cheers, Jim Cooper _____________________________________________ Jim Cooper jcooper (AT) tabdee (DOT) ltd.uk Skype : jim.cooper Tabdee Ltd http://www.tabdee.ltd.uk TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm _____________________________________________ Back to top Jim Cooper Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 4:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Quote: Are there any suggestions from anyone already doing this? It's a great way to work. You need enough RAM to make it go (processor speed is less important). I have 1G and I can only really have one VM open at a time (I'm using VMWare). I also have my VMs on an external HD. You will need quite a bit of storage if you have many customers. I have a base VM with a clean XP install that I can use to create new VMs easily (actually I have a tree of them, eg have a clean install of Delphi on one) without having to reinstall the OS all the time. I use one VM only for testing software I've downloaded, so my host machine is much cleaner than it used to be :-) Quote: Also how do you handle your source code? I use Evolution for source code control (free for single user). The server runs on the host machine and a client on each VM. That way backup is in one place. Network access through the VM (which is how you get at the host) can be a bit too slow for compilation purposes, IME.. Cheers, Jim Cooper _____________________________________________ Jim Cooper jcooper (AT) tabdee (DOT) ltd.uk Skype : jim.cooper Tabdee Ltd http://www.tabdee.ltd.uk TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm _____________________________________________ Back to top Jim Cooper Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Quote: Does Evolution integrate in with Delphi or is it standalone? Standalone I'm not particularly fussed about VCS integration to IDEs, to be honest. I prefer to have a client where I can see what's happening in the repository. Cheers, Jim Cooper _____________________________________________ Jim Cooper jcooper (AT) tabdee (DOT) ltd.uk Skype : jim.cooper Tabdee Ltd http://www.tabdee.ltd.uk TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm _____________________________________________ Back to top Ingvar Nilsen Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Jim Cooper wrote: Quote: I dropped it for development because it does not understand my multi monitor setup. Ah, OK. I only have a single monitor laptop, so I haven't noticed :-) Those using DirectX, games etc. seem to dislike the VM. Again, I don't have any games, so I haven't noticed that either. I haven't either, and now you know why <g> -- Ingvar Nilsen http://www.ingvarius.com Back to top Bern Rudisill Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Thank You for your comments. I am really hyped about doing my development like this. I agree, I was already leaning on having the souce code in the VM. I am currently using JCL Souce control but an looking for something a little better, have the souce control see you project as a new project just because you moved the folder is a pain. Do you have any suggestions? Bern Jesper Hogstrom (Borland) wrote: Quote: Bern Rudisill wrote: Are there any suggestions from anyone already doing this? Also how do you handle your source code? Do you have in the actual VM or do you have it on your physical Hard Drive and access it through the VM? My experience from trying this seemed to indicate disk access is faster when accessing the virtual disk than when accessing a shared folder on the host machine. ymmv. If you want to be able to make a complete snapshot/clone you are better off having everything in your environment on the VM. That does not in any way speak against using a source control system. --Jesper -- Back to top Bern Rudisill Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Thank You for your comments. I am really hyped about doing my development like this. I currently have 2 gigs of memory on my development machine (which is a Pentium M laptop) I also have a tree of VMs ( I also use VMWare) and I agree it makes life much easier I am currently using JCL Souce control but an looking for something a little better, have the souce control see you project as a new project just because you moved the folder is a pain. Does Evolution integrate in with Delphi or is it standalone? Jim Cooper wrote: Quote: Are there any suggestions from anyone already doing this? It's a great way to work. You need enough RAM to make it go (processor speed is less important). I have 1G and I can only really have one VM open at a time (I'm using VMWare). I also have my VMs on an external HD. You will need quite a bit of storage if you have many customers. I have a base VM with a clean XP install that I can use to create new VMs easily (actually I have a tree of them, eg have a clean install of Delphi on one) without having to reinstall the OS all the time. I use one VM only for testing software I've downloaded, so my host machine is much cleaner than it used to be :-) Also how do you handle your source code? I use Evolution for source code control (free for single user). The server runs on the host machine and a client on each VM. That way backup is in one place. Network access through the VM (which is how you get at the host) can be a bit too slow for compilation purposes, IME.. Cheers, Jim Cooper _____________________________________________ Jim Cooper jcooper (AT) tabdee (DOT) ltd.uk Skype : jim.cooper Tabdee Ltd http://www.tabdee.ltd.uk TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm _____________________________________________ -- Back to top Bern Rudisill Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Thank You for your comments. I am really hyped about doing my development like this. I currently have 2 gigs of memory on my development machine (which is a Pentium M laptop) I also have a tree of VMs ( I also use VMWare) and I agree it makes life much easier I am currently using JCL Souce control but an looking for something a little better, have the souce control see you project as a new project just because you moved the folder is a pain. Do you have any suggestions? Bern Ralf Mimoun wrote: Quote: Bern Rudisill wrote: Hello everyone, I am converting over my development to start developing in VMs, I can see a great benefit of being able to backup the exact development system (VCLs and all) when creating my masters at each release. Same here - and I can switch to another computer in almost no time. Foobar'ed hardware does not puzzle me, I am back in business in about 10 minutes. Are there any suggestions from anyone already doing this? Get RAM. More RAM. I work with 2 GB, less and you have to think too often what you must close (eg. a small VM running the db server) to open another VM. Also how do you handle your source code? Do you have in the actual VM or do you have it on your physical Hard Drive and access it through the VM? In the VM, but as a copy of a svn repository. That svn server is running on another machine, of course also in a VM :-) Ralf -- Back to top Sarah Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Jim Cooper wrote: Quote: It's a great way to work. You need enough RAM to make it go (processor snip 1) Can we share this kind of a development environment with someone else who also can use VMWare but having hard time in installing third-party components with proper dependency? In that case how big such vm image can be? For example, The VM node + D2006 + 100MB Third-Party components + 20 MB project source. I have no experience with any virtual machine, including the VMWare. But, if the above thing is feasible, I will learn this stuff. 2) I heard M$ also has a VM that comes with the OS. How good is that? Thanks, Sarah Back to top Jim Cooper Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Quote: I dropped it for development because it does not understand my multi monitor setup. Ah, OK. I only have a single monitor laptop, so I haven't noticed :-) Quote: Those using DirectX, games etc. seem to dislike the VM. Again, I don't have any games, so I haven't noticed that either. Cheers, Jim Cooper _____________________________________________ Jim Cooper jcooper (AT) tabdee (DOT) ltd.uk Skype : jim.cooper Tabdee Ltd http://www.tabdee.ltd.uk TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm _____________________________________________ Back to top Harry Barclay Guest Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Developing in a VM Jim Cooper wrote: Quote: I'm not particularly fussed about VCS integration to IDEs, to be honest. I'm the same way. We use StarTeam, and as much as I like StarTeam for Version Control, I haven't even looked at using the integration with the IDE. 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