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Sting · Guest

I'm evaluating D2005 for my company.

We have been using D6 for webdevelopment for a while now (websnap).
We bought 7 D8 licences to make the transition to .net, but none of them
are being used because of the known problems.

Because we don't want to make the same mistake twice, i'm now looking if
D2005 is a usable replacement for D8 webdevelopment.
I'm writing a Webapplication that is going to go live in september, so
it's an evaluation in a real development environment.

For now my advice will to abandon delphi.

Why?

I have the following problems.

1) Rather big memoryleak in the compiler.
This is easy to reproduce.
Make new .net project
Open the default unit and compile 10 times (ctrl-F9).
You will see an average loss of about 5Mb.
This means that D2005 is vertually unlusable on 512Mb machines.
We can't upgrade all our machines to 1Gb or more (budget reasons).
2) Variables can't be debugged.
All I get in the evaluate box is
'(compiler error): symbol is not linked in executable'
Local variables can be inspected, but not evaluated.
3) When creating an event in the designer,
it is created as strictly private.
This doesn't work.
The declaration has to be moved to the
strictly protected section of the code.
But since I don't use the designer anymore,
this is not such a big issue (cfr 4).
4) The designer saves faulty code.
I know this is because of the used MSHTML control.
I can correct the faulty code, but I can't save it,
it reverts to bad code again.
I would like D2005 to save my code as I wrote it.
For now I use HTML-kit to write my aspx / ascx files.
5) The projectmamager has some bugs.
There are both unit.pas and unit.ascx in the projectlist.
Normally I would expect to find unit.pas 'hanging' below the .ascx
I have to be very careful not to open the unit.pas
The designer there is empty
and if I accidentally have both the ascx and pas open,
D2006 crashes when altering the code in one of the tabpages.
With some files i *have* to click on the .pas to open the aspx.
'lucky' for me, my project only has about 50 units,
so I remember when to click the .pas and when the .aspx/ascx.
There is no logic as far as I can see.
6) Also in the projectmanager:
whenever opening a ascx witch inherits from an other component,
I allways get an errorbox 'incorrect parameter'
(translated form dutch 'De parameter is onjuist')
The ascx is not opened
and the projectmanager jumps to its previous location.
I have to find and open the ascx a second time to open it.
Each time I save I get the same error for every ascx that is open.
<sarcastic>
(So I have to keep the number of sources open to a minimum
because of my RSI Wink

)
</sarcastic>

I have the enterprise version.
Following patches are installed
- update 3
- Unofficial patch for QC#14007
- Rtl90 patch.
System is a P4 3 Ghz 1Gb mem, 40 Gig HD
XP SP2

I can't defend spending 7 times the cost of D2005 as a patch for our
unusable D8's when most of the problems in D8 are still present in D2005.

Unless I can offer a good fix for these problems, I'll have no other
choice to advise a change to Visual studio.

Hope somebody can help me in this.

Sting

PS
I originally posted this in ide, but that part of the ng seems to be
without traffic.

Johnnie Norsworthy · Guest

I too, have a new application going "live" in September. I won't be using
Delphi for it. The first, for me, since Borland provided me the first Pascal
compiler I ever used way back in time (1985).

Good luck with your endeavors, sir.

-Johnnie

(before this venture, I have had a few C# web services and ASP.NET
applications that serviced my Delphi Win32 code)

Richard Grossman · Guest

Sting wrote:

Peter Morris [Droopy eyes · Guest

I thought that although negative his original posting was presented well and
didn't smell of the usual "moaning child" post.

What follows are general responses to your statements rather than a comment
on D2005, which I personally use most days and have no problems with at all
(512MB ram).

Sting · Guest

Richard Grossman wrote:

Leonel · Guest

Sting wrote:

Bruce McGee · Guest

See, this is what I'm talking about. I'm sorry you're having problems
with Delphi 2005, but really appreciate your balanced and professional
tone.

Unfortunately, I'm not doing any ASP.Net work, so I can't speak to most
of your issues. Sorry. Nick Hodges has done more ASP.Net work in
Delphi than anyone I know, and Steve Trefethen pops in here every once
in a while. They might have some more specific suggestions. If you
have some budget to do an evaluation, you might even consider
contacting someone like Nick for a couple of hours of consulting to
help with the evaluation and/or help you navigate around some problems.
I do this all the time when I'm looking at using a new technology. It
can be quicker than finding all of the rough spots on my own.

Do you know if there are QC reports for your issues? This will help
bring them to the attention of the right Borland people and is a good
place to collect work arounds. If nothing else they're more likely to
get fixed in a future release if they're reported. Small consolation,
I know.

Working primarily on Win32 applications, I see memory growth, but it
levels off. Unfortunately, 512MB isn't enough for me, especially with
all of the junk I always have running. I'd try to find a way to get
these machines upgraded to 1Gig.

If budget is an issue, you might want to send someone (or two) to the
Borland conference. They're offering pretty serious discounts on
Delphi 2005 with software assurance that will more than offset the cost
of the trip and any memory upgrade. Penny pinchers swoon in the face
of a solid business case that saves them money, even if they have to
risk you having some fun. :)

http://borland.com/devcon

You mention that the IDE group is pretty barren. How about some of the
ASP.Net groups?

You might want to send a copy of your post to Developer Relations and
ask for a pointer in the right direction. Think of it as a pre-sales
question. If they don't get back right away, send it again.

Lastly, you should take the time to look at Visual Studio 2005. I
think there are more than enough reasons to prefer and stick with
Delphi, but it only makes sense to evaluate all of your options and
make an informed decision.

Very best of luck.

--
Regards,
Bruce McGee
Glooscap Software

Craig Stuntz [TeamB] · Guest

Leonel wrote:

John Jacobson aka Captain · Guest

Sting <Sting (AT) nospam (DOT) mail.be> wrote in message
<42e72bfa$1 (AT) newsgroups (DOT) borland.com>

John Jacobson aka Captain · Guest

Sting <Sting (AT) nospam (DOT) mail.be> wrote in message
<42e75bb6$1 (AT) newsgroups (DOT) borland.com>

Lee Grissom · Guest

Sting wrote:

Angra Mainyu · Guest

"John Jacobson aka Captain Jake" wrote

Craig Stuntz [TeamB] · Guest

Angra Mainyu wrote:

TObject · Guest

"Sting" <Sting (AT) nospam (DOT) mail.be> wrote

Captain Jake · Guest

"Angra Mainyu" <angra (AT) nospam4me (DOT) com> wrote