BorlandTalk.com Borland discussion newsgroups   Archives   FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  JB2007 Goto page 1, 2  Next          BorlandTalk.com Forum Index -> JBuilder IDE View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message Ken Warner Guest Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 7:32 am    Post subject: JB2007 So no mention of a GUI builder -- is Designer gone from JB? Back to top Tim Anderson Guest Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 9:13 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 "Ken Warner" <kwarner (AT) cts (DOT) com> wrote in message news:4563a7a6$1 (AT) newsgroups (DOT) borland.com... Quote: So no mention of a GUI builder -- is Designer gone from JB? Here are my first impressions: http://www.itwriting.com/blog/?p=57 Tim Back to top Doychin Bondzhev Guest Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 9:13 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 It is not. There is Visual Editor which is quite different from what you are used to with JBuilder. Doychin Ken Warner wrote: > So no mention of a GUI builder -- is Designer gone from JB? Back to top Ken Warner Guest Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2006 2:33 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 Tim Anderson wrote: Quote: "Ken Warner" <kwarner (AT) cts (DOT) com> wrote in message news:4563a7a6$1 (AT) newsgroups (DOT) borland.com... So no mention of a GUI builder -- is Designer gone from JB? Here are my first impressions: http://www.itwriting.com/blog/?p=57 Tim Thanks Tim, very useful perspectives in both your's and Joe's writings. Sigh -- I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and just go Eclipse. None of the, "...extend the IDE in both familiar and new ways instead..." work looks like it will be useful to me. Doesn't make any sense to pay for something that is basically free. Back to top legolas wood Guest Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2006 9:13 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 Ken Warner wrote: Quote: Tim Anderson wrote: "Ken Warner" <kwarner (AT) cts (DOT) com> wrote in message news:4563a7a6$1 (AT) newsgroups (DOT) borland.com... So no mention of a GUI builder -- is Designer gone from JB? Here are my first impressions: http://www.itwriting.com/blog/?p=57 Tim Thanks Tim, very useful perspectives in both your's and Joe's writings. Sigh -- I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and just go Eclipse. None of the, "...extend the IDE in both familiar and new ways instead..." work looks like it will be useful to me. Doesn't make any sense to pay for something that is basically free. About borland i should say that they should try very hard to gain that big market share that once they had. now with IDEs like Netbeans and JDeveloper a rare group of people will pay for eclipse based IDE. JDeveloper and Netbeans are neat IDEs for none Eclipse people, and for eclipse one would by MyEclipse IDE subscription and not a 2k Borland JBuilder. It is correct that JBuilder has Together 4 Eclipse integrated but there are some other case tool available for Eclipse too. about life cycle and collaboration, i can not comment. Back to top David Orriss, Jr. [TeamB] Guest Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:15 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 On Wed, 22 Nov 2006 12:33:08 -0800, Ken Warner wrote: Quote: Tim Anderson wrote: "Ken Warner" <kwarner (AT) cts (DOT) com> wrote in message news:4563a7a6$1 (AT) newsgroups (DOT) borland.com... So no mention of a GUI builder -- is Designer gone from JB? Here are my first impressions: http://www.itwriting.com/blog/?p=57 Tim Thanks Tim, very useful perspectives in both your's and Joe's writings. Sigh -- I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and just go Eclipse. None of the, "...extend the IDE in both familiar and new ways instead..." work looks like it will be useful to me. Doesn't make any sense to pay for something that is basically free. Pardon me for chiming in but I do think that's a bit unfair. Yes, you can go and put together a bunch of plugins and get *some* of the functionality you want, but you will *not* end up with JBuilder 2007. In fact I find most of the free plugins for doing J2EE development barely usable. It takes developers and hard work to get the code from those plugins, make it function well, and then put it in a product to make the time to use Eclipse worth the trouble. I'm sorry.. but Eclipse + Free Plugins = Junk in most cases. Borland has taken a HUGE step and risk in making a new JBuilder for a new generation of developers. And for the most part I think it was a step forward, too. Sure there are a few things that still need to be worked, but Borland's already on those tasks. As for a GUI designer, actually VE isn't too bad - in fact it's one of the better plugins available. Try it out separate from JBuilder 2007 and see what you think. -- David Orriss Jr. [TeamB] http://www.codethought.com * Please limit all responses to the newsgroups. Thanks! * My blog: http://codethought.com/blog (NEW) Save yourself some time and check these sites: Borland Newsgroup Search: http://www.borland.com/newsgroups/ngsearch.html Joi Ellis's Faq-O-Matic: http://www.visi.com/~gyles19/fom-serve/cache/1.html Back to top Ken Warner Guest Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:24 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 David Orriss, Jr. [TeamB] wrote: Quote: On Wed, 22 Nov 2006 12:33:08 -0800, Ken Warner wrote: So no mention of a GUI builder -- is Designer gone from JB? Thanks Tim, very useful perspectives in both your's and Joe's writings. Sigh -- I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and just go Eclipse. None of the, "...extend the IDE in both familiar and new ways instead..." work looks like it will be useful to me. Doesn't make any sense to pay for something that is basically free. Pardon me for chiming in but I do think that's a bit unfair. Yes, you can go and put together a bunch of plugins and get *some* of the functionality you want, but you will *not* end up with JBuilder 2007. In fact I find most of the free plugins for doing J2EE development barely usable. It takes developers and hard work to get the code from those plugins, make it function well, and then put it in a product to make the time to use Eclipse worth the trouble. I'm sorry.. but Eclipse + Free Plugins = Junk in most cases. Borland has taken a HUGE step and risk in making a new JBuilder for a new generation of developers. And for the most part I think it was a step forward, too. Sure there are a few things that still need to be worked, but Borland's already on those tasks. As for a GUI designer, actually VE isn't too bad - in fact it's one of the better plugins available. Try it out separate from JBuilder 2007 and see what you think. Unfair? I think your unfair comment is unfair :-) The thing is, I don't need most or all of the stuff Borland/CodeDev put in JBuilder/Eclipse 2007 (I really don't need all the marketing hype). The one tool I do use a lot is/was the Designer. But I will try VE. Could someone tell me where I can get it before I find it on Google? Back to top Ken Warner Guest Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:39 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 Well, I'm SOL. Not one to have deep pockets am I. Of course I'm being unfair to those that do have deep pockets... I'm pretty much a Foundation fella until I get hired by some guy wearing a tie that's too tight. How much does JBuilder 2007 cost? Special introductory pricing ($USD) for JBuilder 2007 is available until Dec 31, 2006. JBuilder 2007 New user Upgrade Support & Maintenance Yr Enterprise $1,999 $999 $600 Yr Professional $799 $479 $240 Yr Developer $399 $199 $120 Yr Back to top David Orriss, Jr. [TeamB] Guest Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2006 4:03 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 11:24:10 -0800, Ken Warner wrote: Quote: Unfair? I think your unfair comment is unfair :-) :-) Quote: The thing is, I don't need most or all of the stuff Borland/CodeDev put in JBuilder/Eclipse 2007 (I really don't need all the marketing hype). The one tool I do use a lot is/was the Designer. But I will try VE. Like I said.. it's not bad.. esp given the VE price. Quote: Could someone tell me where I can get it before I find it on Google? But of course...! http://www.eclipse.org/vep/WebContent/main.php -- David Orriss Jr. [TeamB] http://www.codethought.com * Please limit all responses to the newsgroups. Thanks! * My blog: http://codethought.com/blog (NEW) Save yourself some time and check these sites: Borland Newsgroup Search: http://www.borland.com/newsgroups/ngsearch.html Joi Ellis's Faq-O-Matic: http://www.visi.com/~gyles19/fom-serve/cache/1.html Back to top David Orriss, Jr. [TeamB] Guest Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2006 4:08 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 11:39:24 -0800, Ken Warner wrote: Quote: How much does JBuilder 2007 cost? Special introductory pricing ($USD) for JBuilder 2007 is available until Dec 31, 2006. JBuilder 2007 New user Upgrade Support & Maintenance Yr Well, I understand that, too... But even at the Developer Edition at 300 bucks you even get Together and OptimizeIt.. Each of those tools by *themselves* costs more... http://www.borland.com/resources/en/pdf/products/jbuilder/jbuilder_feature_matrix.pdf or http://tinyurl.com/yham6g -- David Orriss Jr. [TeamB] http://www.codethought.com * Please limit all responses to the newsgroups. Thanks! * My blog: http://codethought.com/blog (NEW) Save yourself some time and check these sites: Borland Newsgroup Search: http://www.borland.com/newsgroups/ngsearch.html Joi Ellis's Faq-O-Matic: http://www.visi.com/~gyles19/fom-serve/cache/1.html Back to top Ken Warner Guest Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 6:11 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 David Orriss, Jr. [TeamB] wrote: Quote: On Mon, 27 Nov 2006 11:39:24 -0800, Ken Warner wrote: How much does JBuilder 2007 cost? Special introductory pricing ($USD) for JBuilder 2007 is available until Dec 31, 2006. JBuilder 2007 New user Upgrade Support & Maintenance Yr Well, I understand that, too... But even at the Developer Edition at 300 bucks you even get Together and OptimizeIt.. Each of those tools by *themselves* costs more... http://www.borland.com/resources/en/pdf/products/jbuilder/jbuilder_feature_matrix.pdf or http://tinyurl.com/yham6g I spent all day Sunday last downloading Eclipse and VE. I mean all day. I have a slow connection. But Eclipse works fine and now all I have to do is learn how to use it. I haven't installed VE yet. Price was right though. $300 is a lot of money to me. I don't have a manager that I can browbeat into buying tools for me. I bought a book: The Java Developer's Guide to Eclipse written by 5 people. D'Anjou; Fairbrother; Kehn; Kellerman; McCarthy -- it's thick and heavy. Anybody else have any favorite Eclipse books? Back to top Janene McCrillis Guest Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:18 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 "Ken Warner" <kwarner (AT) cts (DOT) com> wrote in message news:4563a7a6$1 (AT) newsgroups (DOT) borland.com... Quote: So no mention of a GUI builder -- is Designer gone from JB? NO Designer??? I'm gonna cry. I was so hoping the current Designer would be improved. I use it constantly! I've tried the Eclipse VE and it cannot handle some of the more complex UI's. Borland can do such a better job with a GUI designer! Janene McCrillis *** This post represents my opinion only and not that of my employer, NatureServe *** Back to top David Orriss, Jr. [TeamB] Guest Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 9:13 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 16:18:10 -0700, Janene McCrillis wrote: Quote: "Ken Warner" <kwarner (AT) cts (DOT) com> wrote in message news:4563a7a6$1 (AT) newsgroups (DOT) borland.com... So no mention of a GUI builder -- is Designer gone from JB? NO Designer??? I'm gonna cry. I was so hoping the current Designer would be improved. I use it constantly! I've tried the Eclipse VE and it cannot handle some of the more complex UI's. Borland can do such a better job with a GUI designer! Janene McCrillis *** This post represents my opinion only and not that of my employer, NatureServe *** Janene, I know Borland is working on options for one of the coming updates to 2007. But I hear you about VE. While it *is* an option, it's a pretty cruddy one. -- David Orriss Jr. [TeamB] http://www.codethought.com * Please limit all responses to the newsgroups. Thanks! * My blog: http://codethought.com/blog (NEW) Save yourself some time and check these sites: Borland Newsgroup Search: http://www.borland.com/newsgroups/ngsearch.html Joi Ellis's Faq-O-Matic: http://www.visi.com/~gyles19/fom-serve/cache/1.html Back to top Janene McCrillis Guest Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 12:08 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 "David Orriss, Jr. [TeamB]" <jbuilder_man (AT) davenet (DOT) net> wrote in message news:zmlg9aa9n18y.dlg (AT) news (DOT) davenet.net... Quote: Janene, I know Borland is working on options for one of the coming updates to 2007. But I hear you about VE. While it *is* an option, it's a pretty cruddy one. -- David Orriss Jr. [TeamB] Glad to hear it's not totally dead. I'm highly dependent on the Designer, even though it has quirks. I'm a professional and I need a professional tool. I'll keep my eye on the updates, then. I'll probably stick with 2006 until that point, though. Is there an option in 2007 to use the 2006 Designer? I know having 2 installations of JBuilder hasn't been totally smooth in the past. Janene *** This post represents my opinion only and not that of my employer, NatureServe *** Back to top David Orriss, Jr. [TeamB] Guest Posted: Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:13 am    Post subject: Re: JB2007 On Tue, 12 Dec 2006 11:08:10 -0700, Janene McCrillis wrote: Quote: Is there an option in 2007 to use the 2006 Designer? I know having 2 installations of JBuilder hasn't been totally smooth in the past. Actually you can have as many versions of JBuilder as you'd like on the system at once. You can install a newer version over an *older* version, but they can sit in their own installation directories fine. You could easily use the JB2006 designer and the simply add the code as a new class to your JB2007 project until the JBuilder developers come up with a more permanent solution. -- David Orriss Jr. [TeamB] http://www.codethought.com * Please limit all responses to the newsgroups. Thanks! * My blog: http://codethought.com/blog (NEW) Save yourself some time and check these sites: Borland Newsgroup Search: http://www.borland.com/newsgroups/ngsearch.html Joi Ellis's Faq-O-Matic: http://www.visi.com/~gyles19/fom-serve/cache/1.html Back to top Display posts from previous: All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First         BorlandTalk.com Forum Index -> JBuilder IDE All times are GMT Goto page 1, 2  Next Page 1 of 2   Jump to: Select a forum C++ Builder Newsgroups----------------C++ BuilderC++ Builder (ActiveX)C++ Builder (Announcements)C++ Builder (Command Line Tools)C++ Builder DatabasesC++ Builder Databases (ADO)C++ Builder Databases (Desktop)C++ Builder Databases (InterBase Express)C++ Builder Databases (Multi-Tier)C++ Builder Databases (SQL Servers)C++ Builder (Graphics)C++ Builder (IDE)C++ Builder (Internet)C++ Builder (Internet Socket)C++ Builder (Internet Web)C++ Builder (Jobs)C++ Builder (Language)C++ Builder (Language C++)C++ Builder (Compatibility with MFC)C++ Builder (Native API)C++ Builder (Non-Technical)C++ Builder (Students)C++ Builder (Third Party Tools)C++ Builder (Upgrade)C++ Builder (VCL)C++ Builder (VCL Components Usage)C++ Builder (VCL Components Development)C++ Builder (VCL Usage)C++ Builder (WinAPI)C++ Builder Installation Delphi Newsgroups----------------Delphi (General)Delphi ActiveX Controls UsageDelphi ActiveX Controls DevelopmentDelphi As400Delphi DatabasesDelphi Databases (ADO)Delphi Databases (dbExpress)Delphi Databases (Desktop)Delphi Databases (InterBase Express)Delphi Databases (Multi-Tier)Delphi Databases (SQL Servers)Delphi DeploymentDelphi GraphicsDelphi IDEDelphi InternationalizationDelphi InternetDelphi Internet Isapi-WebBrokerDelphi Internet WebSnapDelphi Internet WinsockDelphi JobsDelphi Language BASMDelphi Language ObjectPascalDelphi Model Driven Architecture (General)Delphi Model Driven Architecture (Third Party)Delphi MultimediaDelphi Native APIDelphi Non-TechnicalDelphi ObjectPascalDelphi OLE AutomationDelphi OO designDelphi OpenToolsAPIDelphi Reporting-ChartingDelphi RTLDelphi StudentsDelphi TeamSourceDelphi Thirdparty ToolsDelphi Thirdparty Tools (General)Delphi Thirdparty Tools (IntraWeb)Delphi Thirdparty Tools (RaveReports)Delphi UpgradeDelphi VCLDelphi VCL ComponentsDelphi VCL Components UsingDelphi VCL Components WritingDelphi WebServices SOAPDelphi WinAPIDelphi XMLDelphi Installationcomp.lang.pascal.delphi.components.misccomp.lang.pascal.delphi.components.usagecomp.lang.pascal.delphi.components.writingcomp.lang.pascal.delphi.databasescomp.lang.pascal.delphi.misccomp.sources.delphi JBuilder Newsgroups----------------JBuilderJBuilder AnnouncementsJBuilder Applet IssuesJBuilder As400JBuilder CompilerJBuilder CORBA/RMIJBuilder DatabasesJBuilder DB SwingJBuilder DebuggerJBuilder DeploymentJBuilder DocumentationJBuilder EnterpriseJBuilder HandheldJBuilder IDEJBuilder JavaJBuilder JavaAPIJBuilder Java LanguageJBuilder Java SwingJBuilder Java BeansJBuilder Java Beans UsageJBuilder Java Beans DevelopmentJBuilder JBCLJBuilder JDataStoreJBuilder JobsJBuilder LinuxJBuilder MacintoshJBuilder & MobileSetJBuilder MultiLingual AppsJBuilder Non-TechnicalJBuilder OpenToolsJBuilder Servlets (JSP)JBuilder StudentsJBuilder Team DevelopmentJBuilder Thirdparty ToolsJBuilder UpgradeJBuilder Installation InterBase Newsgroups----------------InterBaseInterBase Bug DiscussionInterBase GeneralInterBase IBConsoleInterBase OpenSourceInterBase ReplicationInterBase SQLInterBase ThirdpartyInterBase Installation Miscellaneous Borland Newsgroups----------------AppCenterAppServerEnteraVisiBroker  You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2006 phpBB Group SEO toolkit © 2004-2006 webmedic.