BorlandTalk.com Borland discussion newsgroups   Archives   FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Goto page 1, 2  Next          BorlandTalk.com Forum Index -> Delphi Language BASM View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message Avatar Zondertau Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 8:09 am    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Quote: One of the features of the Template B&V by Avatar is that adding functions is done by simple copying in a unit. The unit registers itself and all functions are added to the B&V by register code written in the unit. Is this feature good or bad? IMHO this feature is good, because: - Adding functions to B&V becomes much easier & less work - Each unit is either general or challenge-related. A B&V update can be performed by only overwriting the general units, since these contain no challenge-specific stuff. The second point also means that a templete is not really needed; this templete would mean just taking the general units only. Of course it's easier to just use a previous challenge and edit the challenge-specific units. Back to top Anders Isaksson Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 9:15 am    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Dennis wrote: Quote: One of the features of the Template B&V by Avatar is that adding functions is done by simple copying in a unit. Simple copying is not enough, you must add them to the project too. Quote: Is this feature good or bad? I can't find anything bad about it. Good: For me it reduces the work that has to be done when a new version of the B&V has arrived: Just copy my current .pas files into the new B&V folder, add them to the project and Go! Couldn't be much easier. -- Anders Isaksson, Sweden BlockCAD: http://web.telia.com/~u16122508/proglego.htm Gallery: http://web.telia.com/~u16122508/gallery/index.htm Back to top Dennis Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:14 am    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Hi All No protection against the problem with releasing to different functions with the same name. The B&V manager has to read through all the units to secure that FunctionX is the same as FunctionX in the old unit. This is no fun for him !! Because the B&V manager is only a human he makes mistakes. Sooner or later you will release a unit where new Function1 is different from old Function1. The old Function1 was invalid but it propagated into the library by accident. The library manager sees no reason to update the function in the library from Function1 to Function1, because functions with the same ID are the same ? In short: The rule of strong function ID is not enforced and this will lead to a reduction of quality. Best regards Dennis Back to top Dennis Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 2:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Hi All Big silence !!!! :-) Best regards Dennis Back to top Anders Isaksson Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Dennis wrote: Quote: No protection against the problem with releasing to different functions with the same name. How does 'the other system' protect against this? Quote: The library manager sees no reason to update the function in the library from Function1 to Function1, because functions with the same ID are the same ? Release date of function1? Quote: In short: The rule of strong function ID is not enforced and this will lead to a reduction of quality. I took a look into the B&V source, and it seems the following change may help. It will show a message box about the problem, and not add the function to the function list. (FastcodeChallengeUnit.pas, line 117, 118) uses UtilsUnit, Windows, Dialogs; (FastcodeChallengeUnit.pas, line 237-) function TFastcodeChallenge.RegisterFunction(const FunctionData: TFastcodeChallengeFunction): PFastcodeChallengeFunction; var i: Integer; begin // -- Added check for duplicates for i := 0 to Pred(FFunctionList.Count) do begin if CompareText(PFastcodeChallengeFunction(FFunctionList[i]).Name, FunctionData.Name) = 0 then begin ShowMessage('Duplicate function name: ' + FunctionData.Name + #13#10 + 'Not added to function list!'); Exit; end; if (PFastcodeChallengeFunction(FFunctionList[i]).Addr = FunctionData.Addr) then begin ShowMessage('The same function is used under different names: ' + #13#10 + FunctionData.Name + #13#10 + PFastcodeChallengeFunction(FFunctionList[i]).Name + #13#10 + 'Not added to function list!'); Exit; end; end; // --- end of added code New(Result); try Result^ := FunctionData; FFunctionList.Add(Result); except Dispose(Result); raise; end; end; -- Anders Isaksson, Sweden BlockCAD: http://web.telia.com/~u16122508/proglego.htm Gallery: http://web.telia.com/~u16122508/gallery/index.htm Back to top Dennis Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Hi Anders Quote: How does 'the other system' protect against this? I manually add all functions. If I get a new function with the same name as an existing function, then I rename the new function. Quote: The library manager sees no reason to update the function in the library from Function1 to Function1, because functions with the same ID are the same ? Release date of function1? Noth enough. Have alook in the spreadsheets etc. The function name is the function ID. Quote: In short: The rule of strong function ID is not enforced and this will lead to a reduction of quality. I took a look into the B&V source, and it seems the following change may help. It will show a message box about the problem, and not add the function to the function list. What does this change do? Regards Dennis Back to top Anders Isaksson Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Dennis wrote: Quote: [Anders wrote...] I took a look into the B&V source, and it seems the following change may help. It will show a message box about the problem, and not add the function to the function list. What does this change do? Are you being consciusly obtuse, or are you just answering very quickly? You even quoted my description: "It will show a message box about the problem, and not add the function to the function list" -- Anders Isaksson, Sweden BlockCAD: http://web.telia.com/~u16122508/proglego.htm Gallery: http://web.telia.com/~u16122508/gallery/index.htm Back to top Dennis Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Hi Anders Quote: Are you being consciusly obtuse, or are you just answering very quickly? I want to get every little detail correct in this phase where I am going to turn over full control of Fastcode to you all. Quote: You even quoted my description: "It will show a message box about the problem, and not add the function to the function list" Will it catch the case where a new unit with function1 replaces a unit with function 1 in it? Say: Person X releases a XUnit.Pas with function 1 in it. Then he releases a new version of XUnit.pas with function 2 added. Then the B&V manager overwrites the old XUnit.pas with the new XUnit.pas. This way function 1 is replaced with function 1 which can be atotally different function. Does your code check for duplicates only? To repeat: I want to be 100 % sure that you guys are on the rigth page before turning control over to you. Regards Dennis Back to top Avatar Zondertau Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Quote: How does 'the other system' protect against this? I manually add all functions. If I get a new function with the same name as an existing function, then I rename the new function. There's nothing in the new system that would prevent one from manually inserting the functions. The advantage of not having to modify the form would still be there, and the same goes for the advantage that general and challenge-specific units are separated. In fact in some (i admit: not all) cases i used WinMerge to join the existing units fwith the new submission. This allows one to review all changes and make sure that the function name is changed. Back to top Dennis Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Hi Avatar It looks like you understand the scenario ;-) Do you want to be the B&V manager from now on? I agree that both system offers no real protection against the function ID problem. The responsibilty is the B&V managers. I had the understanding that my B&V offered a better protection against the problem. I see now that it does not. Thanks for enlightning me ;-) Best regards Dennis Back to top Dennis Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Hi Anders Quote: Are you being consciusly obtuse, or are you just answering very quickly? I just learned a new word Obtuse describes very well my behaviour. My problem is that I see very few signs of respect for and understanding of the function ID problem. Pierre just showed no signs at all in the other thread. (But I am sure that he understands the potential problem well.) If the community shows disrespect for all the details that are the basis for the high quality standards, then quality will decline under the new management. Regards Dennis -- Jeg beskyttes af den gratis SPAMfighter til privatbrugere. Den har indtil videre sparet mig for at få 1400 spam-mails. Betalende brugere får ikke denne besked i deres e-mails. Hent gratis SPAMfighter her: www.spamfighter.dk Back to top Avatar Zondertau Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Quote: It looks like you understand the scenario ;-) Do you want to be the B&V manager from now on? I like to contribute to the Fastcode project but unfortunately i don't always have time. This would mean that at times i might be able to be a good B&V manager, but at other times i might not be able to make a single release for a month or more. You have probably seen this as well for my current two B&Vs: the time i have available is very irregular. I think many here have this problem, which may make it fairly difficult to let others manage the project. Perhaps this includes even you now, if this is your reason for handing over Fastcode to others? Unless some people are able to donate a significant and consistent share of their available time to the project i think the only solution might be to allow many people to simultaneously work on (the same) B&Vs. Until now this wasn't really needed because you were always there, but now that may be more difficult. Back to top Dennis Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 6:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Hi Avatar Yes - I agree with you. I am not at all sure how we should organize it. If anybody have ideas or are willing to sign up on some tasks then please do it in the "Fastcode management" thread. I am holding back a little, because I would like you all to organize it the way you like it. Regards Dennis Back to top Anders Isaksson Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 6:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Dennis wrote: Quote: I just learned a new word We're never too old to learn. Quote: My problem is that I see very few signs of respect for and understanding of the function ID problem. I'm sorry. I thought I gave you a tool to help with the problem, and quite timely too. Quote: If the community shows disrespect for all the details that are the basis for the high quality standards, then quality will decline under the new management. I think that's a bit premature. You have run Fastcode more or less as a one man show since the beginning, you've run into all the practical problems, you have everything in your head. Then you expect us others to see it all in a *very* short time, and start complaining when we don't jump at once. Just when you have bought the new computers too, with donated money. Don't you see how it looks: "I've got my computers, now it's time to pull out" (I'm definitely not saying I believe that's it, I think I know you better than that, but it surely could be seen that way). It seems to me you are showing disrespect for the community! You are not giving them/us a chance to react to your little bombshell - "I need to pull out. Now.". Sit back, calm down, and *help* us to organize this thing instead of naggin on everything we didn't think of. Of course we want the project to go on, and of course we don't want it to drag you down. Sinking in overwork is not a pleasant feeling... Once again, sit back, calm down, and help us! -- Anders Isaksson, Sweden BlockCAD: http://web.telia.com/~u16122508/proglego.htm Gallery: http://web.telia.com/~u16122508/gallery/index.htm Back to top Dennis Guest Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 6:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Fastcode Template B&V's Hi Anders Quote: Once again, sit back, calm down, and help us! I will but I need to see some progress everyday. It is actually harder to me to run this hand over process than to run the project. I will be around but I need someone to stand up and take over some responsibilities. It is 100% certain that I should calm down Sorry. 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