BorlandTalk.com Borland discussion newsgroups   Archives   FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  VCL.net and Win64 Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next          BorlandTalk.com Forum Index -> Delphi Non-Technical View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message Abdullah Kauchali Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 6:39 am    Post subject: VCL.net and Win64 Can someone please help clear some blatant ignorance on my side here: :) I currently understand that VCL.Net is a managed wrapper around the existing native Win32 VCL. Great stuff. So, how will my VCL.Net applications run under Win64? Do I have to rewrite to Winforms if I expect my applications to migrate to Win64? Kind regards, Abdullah Back to top Dave Nottage [TeamB] Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:21 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Abdullah Kauchali wrote: Quote: So, how will my VCL.Net applications run under Win64? Because Win64 apparently supports Win32 -- Dave Nottage [TeamB] Back to top Abdullah Kauchali Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:54 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Dave Nottage [TeamB] wrote: Quote: Because Win64 apparently supports Win32 Grrrr .... (You're getting defensive already ... why?) Dave, Will my underlying code (behind the managed wrappers, that is) be running under emulation mode then? Can you explain a little bit on /how/ that's going to work? Is there a link I can read about migration options for VCL.Net apps intending to move to .NET Win64? (I am not asking about native 64bit, but rather 64bit .NET or even more precisely, .NET on a Windows 64bit operating system). Thanks, Abdullah Back to top Dave Nottage [TeamB] Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 9:04 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Abdullah Kauchali wrote: Quote: Because Win64 apparently supports Win32 Grrrr .... (You're getting defensive already ... why?) FWIW, I wasn't being defensive, however I misread your post anyway. There was some discussion on the subject earlier, which you might be able to find using Google. -- Dave Nottage [TeamB] Back to top Abdullah Kauchali Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 9:28 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Dave Nottage [TeamB] wrote: Quote: FWIW, I wasn't being defensive, however I misread your post anyway. In hindsight, I wasn't clear either. What I meant to say was: what is the possibility of my existing VCL.NET applications to run as true 64bit /.NET applications/ on a 64bit Windows OS? (How do I avoid the emulation mode issue considering that VCL.NET is simply a wrapper around Win32VCL?) Quote: There was some discussion on the subject earlier, which you might be able to find using Google. I have. Nothing substantial there, though ... thanks, anyway. (I hope someone chimes in ...) Back to top Uffe Kousgaard Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 9:37 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 "Abdullah Kauchali" <non (AT) non (DOT) com> wrote Quote: (How do I avoid the emulation mode issue considering that VCL.NET is simply a wrapper around Win32VCL?) Is it? Are you sure? Back to top Abdullah Kauchali Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 9:42 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Uffe Kousgaard wrote: Quote: Is it? Are you sure? You mean it isn't???? Oh sh**! I'm not sure, now that you ask. LOL! I swear I've read somewhere that VCL.NET is a .NET managed wrapper /over/ Win32 VCL. So, please correct me, if I am wrong! (This is even more confusing than I thought!) Back to top Abdullah Kauchali Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 9:51 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Uffe Kousgaard wrote: Quote: Is it? Are you sure? Trying to confuse me, are you? :) Zarko says this: "So what is VCL.NET? Is it VCL is it .Net? If we put it simple, VCL.NET provides the means to create VCL Forms applications, which are Delphi forms that are .NET-enabled, and use VCL.NET components. Now, VCL.NET components are those good old VCL components just wrapped in the .Net "shell"." http://delphi.about.com/od/vclnet/a/aa082404a.htm (So, what are you asking?) Back to top Will DeWitt Jr. Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 9:55 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Abdullah Kauchali wrote in <42f33477 (AT) newsgroups (DOT) borland.com>: Quote: I swear I've read somewhere that VCL.NET is a .NET managed wrapper /over/ Win32 VCL. So, please correct me, if I am wrong! VCL.NET uses P/Invoke to get at the Win32 API. I'm pretty sure you can't use VCL.NET in 64-bit .NET apps. Will -- Want native support in Delphi for AMD64/EM64T? Vote here-- http://qc.borland.com/wc/qcmain.aspx?d=7324 Back to top Uffe Kousgaard Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 9:58 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 "Abdullah Kauchali" <non (AT) non (DOT) com> wrote Quote: Trying to confuse me, are you? No. Quote: Zarko says this: "So what is VCL.NET? Is it VCL is it .Net? If we put it simple, VCL.NET provides the means to create VCL Forms applications, which are Delphi forms that are .NET-enabled, and use VCL.NET components. Now, VCL.NET components are those good old VCL components just wrapped in the .Net "shell"." http://delphi.about.com/od/vclnet/a/aa082404a.htm I believe the VCL.NET components are either wrappers around the win32 API / ..NET API or native components, meaning the source code to many of them are available as part of Delphi.NET - upgraded versions of the VCL counterparts. I don't see that as a wrapper. It is a new branch off of the win32 VCL (in the same way win32 VCL was a branch off of win16 VCL). Regards Uffe Back to top Abdullah Kauchali Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 10:00 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Will DeWitt Jr. wrote: Quote: VCL.NET uses P/Invoke to get at the Win32 API. I'm pretty sure you can't use VCL.NET in 64-bit .NET apps. Understood. What you say makes sense. My question then is, what is the migration plan for VCL.NET applications ito 64bit .NET? What options do I have to avoid my .NET application to run under emulation mode in the future? Anyone know this????? Back to top Abdullah Kauchali Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 10:03 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Uffe Kousgaard wrote: Quote: I don't see that as a wrapper. It is a new branch off of the win32 VCL (in the same way win32 VCL was a branch off of win16 VCL). Can someone with appropriate knowledge please confirm this? Back to top David Wilcockson Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 10:23 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 You might want to look at: http://blogs.borland.com/dcc/archive/2004/03/31/2378.aspx Especially: "The careful observer will notice that there is no mention of VCL for .NET in those test results. We need to massage the P/Invoke DLLImport declarations VCL for .NET uses to bind to the Win64 API, just as Microsoft has had to do with WinForms. I haven't found any indications that VCL for ..NET cannot support 64 bit execution." (This was March 2004) David "Abdullah Kauchali" <non (AT) non (DOT) com> wrote Quote: Dave Nottage [TeamB] wrote: Because Win64 apparently supports Win32 Grrrr .... (You're getting defensive already ... why?) Dave, Will my underlying code (behind the managed wrappers, that is) be running under emulation mode then? Can you explain a little bit on /how/ that's going to work? Is there a link I can read about migration options for VCL.Net apps intending to move to .NET Win64? (I am not asking about native 64bit, but rather 64bit .NET or even more precisely, .NET on a Windows 64bit operating system). Thanks, Abdullah Back to top Dave Nottage [TeamB] Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 10:27 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Abdullah Kauchali wrote: Quote: Can someone with appropriate knowledge please confirm this? See David Willcockson's post in this thread. -- Dave Nottage [TeamB] Back to top Lurkio Guest Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 10:33 am    Post subject: Re: VCL.net and Win64 Abdullah Kauchali wrote: Quote: I currently understand that VCL.Net is a managed wrapper around the existing native Win32 VCL. Great stuff. So, how will my VCL.Net applications run under Win64? Do I have to rewrite to Winforms if I expect my applications to migrate to Win64? I always refer back to a good link I read on this kind of thing from a while back : http://blogs.msdn.com/joshwil/archive/2004/03/11/88280.aspx I don't know how much the lay of the land has changed since that was written but I would guess that the basic principles have remained the same. Given the point that you have highlighted about how VCL.Net is actually a managed wrapper of Win32 VCL, I would surmise there is no way that a VCL.Net application would automatically "float up" to become a 64-bit .Net application...but I think you guessed that already :-) If I am right, you've touched on something pretty significant here... 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